General Antisemitism

Competing with the Saudis


Tom Gross has just published a series of antisemitic cartoons from the Arab world on the flotilla incident. The example below is from the June 2, 2010 edition of Al-Iqtisadiyya, a Saudi newspaper.

Now ask yourselves this: is the imagery in the cartoon above all that different from this one by Steve Bell that appeared in the Guardian on June 1, 2010?


For more examples of cartoons from Tom Gross’ Mideast Media Analysis click here.

32 replies »

  1. Steve Bell should see this comparison. I don’t know the man but it is my hope that he would be shocked by how far down the road he has gone to open racism.

  2. Hawkeye

    A comparison too far. The first is directly comparing the IDF with the Nazis by the use of the Hacken Kreuz . Bell’s is OTT possibly… but if the IDF go into international waters with heavily armed people prepared to kill ..why are you surprised if they are portrayed thus?

    Israel cannot flout international law and escape allegations of violent intimidation ..or ..in this case ..depictions of ruthlessness.

  3. Berchmans:
    Although I know that you don’t like to be confused with facts, but here’s something for you to keep in mind when talking about international law:

    http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE65133D20100602

    Q&A: Is Israel’s naval blockade of Gaza legal?
    Jonathan Saul
    LONDON

    What is the legality of the blockade and did Israel’s intervention breach international law? Below are some questions and answers on the issue:

    CAN ISRAEL IMPOSE A NAVAL BLOCKADE ON GAZA?

    Yes it can, according to the law of blockade which was derived from customary international law and codified in the 1909 Declaration of London. It was updated in 1994 in a legally recognized document called the “San Remo Manual on International Law Applicable to Armed Conflicts at Sea.”

    Under some of the key rules, a blockade must be declared and notified to all belligerents and neutral states, access to neutral ports cannot be blocked, and an area can only be blockaded which is under enemy control.

    “On the basis that Hamas is the ruling entity of Gaza and Israel is in the midst of an armed struggle against that ruling entity, the blockade is legal,” said Philip Roche, partner in the shipping disputes and risk management team with law firm Norton Rose.

    WHAT ARE INTERNATIONAL WATERS?

    Under the U.N. Convention of the Law of the Sea a coastal state has a “territorial sea” of 12 nautical miles from the coast over which it is sovereign. Ships of other states are allowed “innocent passage” through such waters.

    There is a further 12 nautical mile zone called the “contiguous zone” over which a state may take action to protect itself or its laws.

    “However, strictly beyond the 12 nautical miles limit the seas are the “high seas” or international waters,” Roche said.

    The Israeli navy said on Monday the Gaza bound flotilla was intercepted 120 km (75 miles) west of Israel. The Turkish captain of one of the vessels told an Istanbul news conference after returning home from Israeli detention they were 68 miles outside Israeli territorial waters.

    Under the law of a blockade, intercepting a vessel could apply globally so long as a ship is bound for a “belligerent” territory, legal experts say.

    CAN ISRAEL USE FORCE WHEN INTERCEPTING SHIPS?

    Under international law it can use force when boarding a ship.

    “If force is disproportionate it would be a violation of the key tenets of the use of force,” said Commander James Kraska, professor of international law at the U.S. Naval War College.

    Israeli authorities said marines who boarded the Turkish vessel Mavi Marmara opened fire in self-defense after activists clubbed and stabbed them and snatched some of their weapons.

    Legal experts say proportional force does not mean that guns cannot be used by forces when being attacked with knives.

    “But there has got to be a relationship between the threat and response,” Kraska said.

    The use of force may also have other repercussions.

    “While the full facts need to emerge from a credible and transparent investigation, from what is known now, it appears that Israel acted within its legal rights,” said J. Peter Pham, a strategic adviser to U.S. and European governments.

    “However, not every operation that the law permits is necessarily prudent from the strategic point of view.”

    OPPONENTS HAVE CALLED ISRAEL’S RAID “PIRACY.” WAS IT?

    No, as under international law it was considered a state action.

    “Whether what Israel did is right or wrong, it is not an act of piracy. Piracy deals with private conduct particularly with a pecuniary or financial interest,” Kraska said.

    HAVE THERE BEEN ANY SHIPPING DISRUPTIONS AFTER THE RAID?

    None so far but the International Chamber of Shipping (ICS), an association which represents 75 percent of the world’s merchant fleet, has expressed “deep concern” over the boarding by Israeli forces, arguing that merchant ships have a right to safe passage and freedom of navigation in international waters.

    “These fundamental principles of international law must always be upheld by all of the world’s nations,” the ICS said.

    Oh, and by the way, how is writing the poem of praise for the IDF going?

  4. al-gharqad

    You must be a new kid on the block believing that facts could influence Berchmans nanosized brain. The Reuters article was shown him on CifWatch more than once, he simply ignored it because it doesn’t match to his Hamas sponsored worldview. He will whining about international law like a broken record (or a parrot of “the Lord is watching from above” kind), any expert opinion would only distract him from his jokes about the child victims of the Holocaust.

  5. al-gharqad

    Why San Remo Does Not Apply ( Craig Murray …an actual expert)

    The Israeli action was ( not) legal under the San Remo Manual of International Law Applicable to Armed Conflicts at Sea.

    Supporters ignore those parts of San Remo that specifically state that it is illegal to enforce a general blockade on an entire population. But even apart from that, San Remo simply does not apply.

    The manual relates specifically to legal practice in time of war. With whom is Israel at war?There is no war. Israeli apologists have gone on to say they are in a state of armed conflict with Gaza.

    Really? In that case, why do we continually hear Israeli complaints about rockets fired from Gaza into Israel? If it is the formal Israeli position that it is in a state of armed conflict with Gaza, then Gaza has every right to attack Israel with rockets.

    QED

  6. OK, but I’m still waiting for the poem of praise for the IDF that he promised if it turns out that he did say that stuff about bonking Anne Frank. Now as most people (except Berchman of course) would agree, this was proven.
    So I’m still waiting to see Berchman’s go at poetry…

  7. Really? In that case, why do we continually hear Israeli complaints about rockets fired from Gaza into Israel? If it is the formal Israeli position that it is in a state of armed conflict with Gaza, then Gaza has every right to attack Israel with rockets.

    Correct, and Israel has every right to retaliate. This is the high time for you to stop whining about the 400 dead children and the whellchair bound cripple…

  8. Berchman
    “The manual relates specifically to legal practice in time of war. With whom is Israel at war?There is no war. Israeli apologists have gone on to say they are in a state of armed conflict with Gaza.

    Really? In that case, why do we continually hear Israeli complaints about rockets fired from Gaza into Israel? If it is the formal Israeli position that it is in a state of armed conflict with Gaza, then Gaza has every right to attack Israel with rockets.”

    Israel is at an armed conflict with terrorists. Gaza has every right to attack Israel with rockets? You meant DELIBERATELY target kindergartens and schools so when Israel fires back Hamas can hide behind kids and then have their buddies like you bash Israel for “killing innocent children”.

    How’s the poem going?

  9. al-gharqad

    .

    ” Gaza has every right to attack Israel with rockets? ”

    You are twisting the Murray quote. The firing of rockets at civilians is a cowardly, murderous and foul affair. He has made this clear many times. He was making the point which you have ignored…that there could not be a state of armed conflict ….otherwise warfare would be justified.

    On at least one hundred occasions I have screamed in bold letters on CIF that these attacks are a ghastly, murderous betrayal of their own people so do not go down that road. Leave it to folk like our Peter.

  10. You are twisting the Murray quote.

    No Berchmans he’s quoted you saying that Gaza has every right to attack Israel with rockets

    I have screamed in bold letters on CIF that these attacks are a ghastly, murderous betrayal of their own people so do not go down that road.

    Pure unadultered lie as usual. You condemned the Quassams saying that their use against civilians is “anti-socialist” and “un-Islamic”.

    Leave it to folk like our Peter

    Our Peter?! Yours are your sick jokes about Anne Frank, your sorry failures as a “childcare worker”, your 72 virgins and your copies of the Quran and the Protocols but not me.

  11. I am really disgusted with you Berchmans.

    After all your arse-licking on the other thread by Dr MacEoin (no doubt to try to impress him, you creep – you’ll be calling him “gentle” next), about condemning attacks on Jews in Glasgow, you try to excuse the incitement to Jew-hatred which is in the Guardian (and in pictures for those who have difficulty reading the trash below the line)!

    Are you really the moron you come across as? Why do you continue to insult the intelligence of those who post here?

    Israel has not flouted international law! Get the person who writes your more sensible posts (you know, the ones where you try to kid us that you look things up in order to trap us) to look up the relevant clauses of maritime law which govern conduct in the case of a blockade (see al-gharqad’s informative post above yourself if you can concentrate for long enough).

    I remember your promise to write a poem in praise of the IDF if it was proven that you wanted to give Anne Frank a blast. Personally, that promise goes to your overblown sense of your abilities generally and given that you can barely string a coherent sentence together, were I al-gharqad I wouldn’t hold my breath for anything sensible in poetry or rhyme. But you did promise, and if you don’t honour your promise, you are a liar aren’t you?

    “At least a hundred occasions” you have screamed in bold letters have you? Liar at least twice over! How is it that you can never, ever reproduce even one of those “bold letter” screams to make your point here? Answer – you wouldn’t dare to scream against the Guardian World View for fear of falling out of favour with your chums at CiF.

    You are a hypocrite and a fool. I don’t know why Hawkeye lets you post here.

  12. Cross-posted from another thread here, two recently released videos of the interrogations of the captain of the Marmara and his chief officer.

    I am not sure about the captain, who’s a sight too relaxed about the whole affair and trying like mad to impress the Israeli questioners.* I wouldn’t put it past him to go back to Turkey and say he was forced to blame IHH under duress.

    *(Berchmans would probably behave the same way but it would be much more sickening and creepy and he is far less good looking)

  13. the despicable berch person always slips in lies as if we won’t notice them. Since when is carrying a paint gun considered to be heavily armed?

  14. peterthehungarian

    “No Berchmans he’s quoted you saying that Gaza has every right to attack Israel with rockets ”

    Peter dont be such a pilchard ..I repeat ..on a hundred occasions I have attacked rockets and attacked anyone who has supported them. It was a Murray quote …showing that Israel could not be at war.

    I keep thinking you must be brighter than you are . I will try not to make this mistake and will ploddingly explain everything.

    Yoho ho

    Why does Hawkeye let me post here…because I keep calling for peace…unconditional peace…I have asked the Palesinians to consider dying before harming a soldier I attack any violence against Israel and have a four year record of doing this.

    I was the first to attack the protesters who attacked the soldiers…even before you. Also…as I keep saying..it is possible he may just believe in free speech.

  15. bERCHMAN: “Really? In that case, why do we continually hear Israeli complaints about rockets fired from Gaza into Israel? If it is the formal Israeli position that it is in a state of armed conflict with Gaza, then Gaza has every right to attack Israel with rockets.”

    That is correct.

    Gaza not only have every right to fire rockets, it was the one that started it.

    As an attacking force, Israel placed Gaza as an hostile entity shortly after the evacuation of Gush Katif.

    This was a direct result of Hamas and Islamic Jihad actions and the Hamas’s refusal to crack down on those firing the rockets.

    The reason why you are hearing israelis state that is because we constantly hear people like you ask why was Gaza attacked in winter 2008.

    This was the result.

    We complain about the lack of respect Gazzan leadership have for human lives.

  16. B: “With whom is Israel at war?”

    Are you looking for countries?

    Iraq.

    You obviously are very poor when it comes to ME history.

    Iraq is the only country which attacked Israel in 1948 which Israel is still in state of war with.

    This is why bombing the Iraqi neuclear reactor in 1982 was legal.

  17. ItsikDeWembley

    .

    “people like you ask why was Gaza attacked in winter 2008.”

    In my opinion Gaza was attacked as a political stunt to get the government re elected. It was an horrific and dishonourable act only not totally disgusting because it was done in the shadow of the US/UKs far far more widespread and appalling destruction of Iraq.

    I have many times said Israel is nothing like as caustically poisonous to the world as we are …they have an excuse…they are a new country fragile as hell and paranoid.

    We have no such excuse.

  18. “…I repeat ..on a hundred occasions I have attacked rockets and attacked anyone who has supported them…”

    And in the next post – and sometimes in the next breath – you have supported the Hamas for “defending itself” in this way!

    And you don’t call for real peace, you moron! You call for the sort of peace which Hamas would not accept because this would involve living side by side with the Jewish state of Israel.

    C’mon gimme a clue – where have you called for peace?

    Hawkeye lets you post here, I believe, because you provide an excellent example of the moronic mindset CiFWatch was formed to undermine.

    And please post here the post, with a web link, where you allegedly were the first to attack the protesters who attacked the soldiers. I’ll bet that if you did so it was because in the fashion of your sleazy friend the Bungler, you weaseled out of blaming them totally but rather took them to task because attacking the IDF would look bad for them.

    Go on, prove me wrong if you can, but I doubt that you can.

    You are an ignominious wretch and no mistake. You aren’t even aware of your lies.

  19. Yes, Berchmans, I’d like to see the post where you “attacked” the protesters for their ambushing the IDF.

    But, like Yohoho, I doubt that you’ll reply with the post or a link to it.

  20. And your post at 12.43pm to ItsikDeWembley proves that you are off your rocker.

    And I’d bet that you wouldn’t dare to post that post to CiF would you?

  21. SilverTrees

    “, I’d like to see the post where you “attacked” the protesters for their ambushing the IDF. ”

    First day afterwards I guess. Funny I was thinking about CIFWatch at the time thinking “this will show them.”

    Why is it you save posts of mine from 4 years ago when it suits… but when I post peaceful posts ..there you are…missing! 🙂

    Yoyo

    “– where have you called for peace? ”

    Ask Peter …he slated me for posting ” No to any rockets ..these are anti Socialist and unIslamic ” …what he did not include is that I always also post that ” these are murderous “.. as I never wish to be seen as just a political animal… but one who “cares about people”…you can google it as you will have no understanding of such a concept .

    If I say I posted it… I posted it… I am not used to having my word queried so I do not keep my own posts ….how sad would that be when you lot do it for me?

    Peace to all. Off to watch Brazil.

  22. “If I say I posted it… I posted it…”

    (I guess that’s code for “I lied” – you’d be only too quick to copy it here had you really done any such thing).

    Berchmans you have a memory like a sieve and a far too vivid imagination. You also tell lies and have at least a distorted sense of reality and probably of time.

    All those being the case, I would have thought you would have been very used to having your word questioned here. You should understand that you have a lot to prove that you are a half-way decent human being given some of the rubbish you have posted here and on CiF.

    So seeing really is believing so far as you are concerned, Berchmans particularly given the company you keep and suck up to at the other place. If I cannot see those posts then I don’t believe you wrote them. You’d have been too scared of being premoderated to do the decent thing on CiF, even for once in your sorry life.

  23. Berchmans, a word to the (not at all) wise – why not begin keeping copies of the posts you say you make against Islamist terror on CiF, together with the links?

    In that way the next time anyone calls you a liar you’d be able to prove them wrong, wouldn’t you?

    Simple really isn’t it?

  24. “…how sad would that be when you lot do it for me?….” says Berchmans.

    Berchmans, in case you didn’t realise people like me keep records of poisonous, crazy or antisemitic posts, yours among them, to illustrate the essential bias against Israel of the Guardian and CiF.

    A reasoned and supportive one against Islamist terror against Israelis would have been so rare that it would have been preserved for posterity.

    That no-one has seen one and saved it has to mean that you have made no such post doesn’t it?

  25. Yohoho

    “, in case you didn’t realise people like me keep records of poisonous, crazy or antisemitic posts, yours among them, ”

    If that were the case you would have seen my posts describing all physical attacks on Israelis as murderous and unacceptable…I say a hundred but it could be more.

    I also started the campaign to get all references to Israel being a nazi state removed…I did this because I could then get the word Islamofascist removed.Both campaigns were successful and now neither is allowed .

    FFS even Peter has seen my posts calling on the rockets to stop and he is most wild eyed of you lot…you must have seen these.

    PS Neither you nor anyone else has ever managed to show me a post which is even vaguely anti Semitic…I will accept they are often poisonous crazy and insensitive ..but tension runs high at times.

  26. I guess your comment about bonking Anne Frank is not “even vaguely anti Semitic”. Were you drunk or tired then? Or was it a case of “tension runs high at times”? Or it never happened but you still apologized for it?

    Most importantly, is it writer’s bloc which prevents us from reading the poem of praise for the IDF?
    Please don’t keep us waiting!

  27. You are doing it again, Berchmans.

    You are absolving yourself from all guilt and blame and responsibility for anything you write which is offensive because “tension runs high at times!”

    Would you excuse a man who bashed his wife and gave that as an excuse?

    You just don’t get it, do you?

    YOU YOURSELF HAVE A RESPONSIBILITY TO BEHAVE AT LEAST DECENTLY, NO MATTER WHAT THE “PROVOCATION” IF YOU WANT TO MIX WITH INTELLIGENT, DECENT PEOPLE! If you cannot control yourself and the antisemitism will out, then SHUT UP! That way at least you won’t look the mean-spirited idiot you are

    Mitnaged saved your scurrilous post to him and there are others of that ilk, captured to posterity, which show you to be a complete arse.

    When I was in college we did an exercise about competences and had to list our

    Conscious competences – things we knew we could do;

    Unconscious competences – things we thought we might be able to do, but had no proof of competency yet;

    Conscious incompetences – things we knew we couldn’t do;

    Unconscious incompetences – that was speculative and a bit of a catch question. Our tutor asked us to imagine what might be most dangerous competency level for, say, a surgeon – of course an unconsciously incompetent surgeon, who might think he/she knew what to do but actually did not because it hadn’t crossed his/her mind that he/she might not know, could kill someone.

    You, Berchmans, operate most of the time in unconsciously incompetent mode. You lack self-reflective capacity, you don’t have the first clue how you come across to others, you think you know a lot and blunder in but quickly show yourself to be at least foolish and lacking. And you take no steps to learn from your past mistakes, you continue to bang on in the same old vein. Thank heavens you are not a brain surgeon.

  28. al-gharqad

    ” I guess your comment about****** Anne Frank is not “even vaguely anti Semitic”. ”

    You are a very wise chappee…after I blooted you into tomorrow about your comment re me over criticising Israel …and I explained that I actually criticise the UK more…you simply change tack… wise..and oily ….you know you cant win an argument… so you just use foul and sexist language in frustration.

    I am not so clever that you have to have sexual tantrums to defeat me…lots do get the better of me…shachtman for instance … but you wont by slurping into the gutter.

  29. Berchman, each time I think you can’t get lower, you keep surprising me.
    Can you please explain how on earth you “blooted me into tomorrow”? I’m waiting impatiently, almost as impatiently as reading the long awaited poem of praise for the IDF, which you promised. In case you forgot (or what’s more probable: chose to forget):
    You said that if I prove that your famous comments about Anne Frank are true, you would write a poem praising the IDF. Since the other people here posted enough evidence, if you had the slightest clue about the meaning of the words “earnest”, “honest” or “fair”, you would have posted your desperate attempt at poetry by now. Being a reader of Guardian, I didn’t expect you to have any of the qualities mentioned above.

    By the way, about using “foul and sexist language”, or “slurping in the gutter”:
    Since English is not my mother tongue, I admit, I had to look up the meaning of the word “bloot”. I googled it, and found that it is a Dutch word, meaning:
    http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/bloot
    blootDefinition from Wiktionary, a free dictionaryJump to: navigation,
    1 Dutch
    1.1 Adjective
    1.1.1 Declension
    1.1.2 Derived terms
    1.1.3 Synonyms
    1.2 Noun
    1.3 References

    [edit] Dutch[edit] Adjective

    bloot (comparative bloter, superlative blootst)

    1. (literally) bare, naked, nude
    2. unprotected, uncovered
    3. unaided
    4. simple, uncomplicated

    Since you never revealed the fact that you speak Dutch (did you learn it while fantasizing about Anne Frank?), I guessed that it is used in English only in slang. And what a surprise I was in for:

    http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=bloot

    1. bloot

    To ejaculate into someones face.
    “So you sprayed face?” “Yep mate she didnt want to swallow so I went bloot.”

    “My girlfriend took my cock out of her mouth just as I was coming and I blooted her.

    2. bloot
    to suck ones own cock until ejaculation
    he likes to bloot when he is alone

    3. bloot
    male version of ‘slut’
    Holy shit, Teddy is SUCH a bloot

    4. bloot

    The confirmation of what has been previously said.
    you: So, the Eagles suck again this year?
    me: bloot

    5. bloot

    Noun) A brother who is the corniest of the trio and is usually in the middle. Occupation Jigglet.
    Are you always such a bloot? or do you just play one?

    I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt and guess that you meant it in the fourth sense, which would only render your comment a vague hint about some imagined victory of yours in a debate. Still, I would be more careful in accusing others of “using foul and sexist language in frustration”.

  30. al-gharqad

    I can assure you that Brochmans never will sing his famous ode to the IDF. This idiotic promise is a trademark of him, he promised on CIF the same if anyone could prove that the Hamas charter contains references of the Protocols. After getting tens of links to different websites he simply started to rant that these sites are Israelis, Americans, this charter is old…, they didn’t take it seriously… this was not antisemitic… they were tired and desperate… naturally he escaped with his (probably very small) tail between his legs, then five minutes later started to brag how he made mincemeat of his opponents.

    He is a fast learner, got the idea from his religiofascist friends like Nasrallah
    You certainly know about the divine victory…when he was forced to stop launching Katyushas, succeded to destroy South-Lebanon and to cause the death of more than 1000 Lebanese…Since this huge victory he can’t show himself in public…
    Certainly Mr. Postman studied the history of the October War of the Egyptians, you know the war that ended with their capitulation agreed upon about 50 miles from Cairo and perceived by them as a huge victory.

    To make a long story short he employs the well known rhetoric of his gentle peaceloving buddies and exactly as deluded by his own grandeur and “victories” as them.

    Regarding the sexist and foul language…
    He’s correct. He never threatened an other poster to rape her in front of her friends… He never said that he would give a blast to Anne Frank demonstrating his delicate sense of humor… all of these are atrocious lies circulated by those pesky Jews…

    As you can see you can rich your English vocabulary simply reading his posts. No sexist and foul anguage… never…